Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

omns wrote:
Mehall wrote:

I still say I like these from rfquerin

Now that a final design has been chosen I think it would be best to focus the discussion on 'yes' or 'no' and the reasons why smile

I'm flattered for sure Mehall, but I like the chosen logo. However... I winced at the mention of the swastica. Personally I don't see it, but at the same time I can see how others might.

What about tweaking holt's logo slightly to make it even less susceptible to this criticism. And no kBang.. I'm not saying making it a glowing green and give it reflection lol I haven't had a chance to play around with it, but there might be some slight tweaking that could be done to make people less apprehensive about it.

Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

Having submitted a number of entries myself, it's obvious I thought there was room for improvement over the current logo.  That being said, I think the winning entry addresses some of the points I had attempted to raise in the original contest thread, namely with respect to scaling issues/typography and the need for various forms depending on what use the logo would be put to.

1.  The winning entry certainly scales well and is easily recognizable even as a tiny 10px x 10px mini icon on the side of a firefox tab.
2.  It's minimalistic, which matches the overall theme of the distro.

On the flip side, it's certainly not obvious where the crunchbang comes from (even less so than currently).  More importantly, while it's certainly an interesting play on the shapes, it has a certain early 90s software logo look to it.  It's a little bland.  With all the amazing tools out there, and looking at other linux logos, it just seems to me like we could do with something with a little more pizazz (some drop shadows, maybe a little perspective to make it look a bit more dynamic and modern - jdugan's similar entry for example, with the merged #! symbol in perspective - the one that spawned a gdm theme, was my favourite).  If scaling down to tiny sizes was a concern, sticking with the 2 character representation at those sizes would be fine (I can't imagine the fedora logo to scales well at 10x10px).

Anyways, I'll go put my vote in now: "YES" because I do think crunchbang deserves branding (and because I participated in the contest and would be disappointed if all that work was for naught).

EDIT: if modification of the entry is on the table (the swastica is definately not something I'd want associated with any public image for a community), maybe a little jazzing up can address any issues I mentionned above.  I'll try to submit a few renders.

Last edited by dalaio (2009-04-01 17:37:23)

Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

Hadn't really taken much care of the Logo-Competition, but being curious took a look at the winning logo. Uups yikes
Like Pobolch I'm from germany and my first thought also was also "swastika".

stopie wrote:

Deep thoughts of stopie:Sucks that Nazism ruined a religious symbol almost as old as time...and that the world cant get past it - but its probably nessicary to prevent such bad things from happening again...idk, its a bit too deep for a forum tongue

Voting Point 1:However, I too first thought "swastika-ish" when I saw the logo, and becasue the world cant get past the Nazi reference, I think it would most certainly = at least some bad press. And #! is still new, so I would venture to say that it should avoid as much bad press as possible. +1 for old Logo

Voting Point 2: I always enjoyed how the old logo #! reminds me of "#! bin/bash" - made crunchbang seem more "linux" than other distributions to me...I know, I'm crazy. But when my friend mentioned that he had seen "#!" before, and I said "bin bash?" - he got a good kick out of it. +1 for old Logo

Well...theres the thought process...Vote = Nope!

I wholeheartedly agree with stopie, especially point 2. I even think that at least potential german users might find that logo reason enough to not even tryout #!.

Keep the old "logo" please.
For me it's quite unique, just like this wonderful distro.

Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

Just an illustration of what I meant by tweaking. I personally think the tweaked version is nicer. Also, *not* viewing it face-on might help as well, that's why I showed perspective versions. Just for discussion purposes:

http://rfquerin.org/cbang/tweaks.png

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Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

The tweaked version definitely invokes less swasitka issues, which I do think is a very valid concern. This looks more like a thatchwork, which is not a bad think to bring to mind. Plus if you look closely you'll see that the tweaked version now has bang!

Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

I voted to keep the original.  It is simple,to the point and works.

The winning entry just doesn't look right to me (no offense, since this is all a matter of taste).  The original #! representing the ChrunchBang name is perfect, but I just don't see the #! when I look at the new logo.  When I see it I think of a logo for sewing/stitching

Last edited by hillsoft (2009-04-01 18:26:45)

Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

Honestly ! I just can't see any swastika ??

/Niels
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Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

Let's keep a lid on any tweaking ideas until after the poll. I think the tweak offered actually accentuates the problem identified so far.

What's on the table here is a simple 'for' or 'against' the proposed new logo.

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Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

Well, the swastika issue makes me reconsider my "for" vote. If I knew when I voted that this logo resembled right-wing swastika-esque logos in post-WWII Germany I'd have been concerned by that. I'd like to hear from more German users whether they see this as a serious problem or something that could go either way.

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Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

Regardless of any symbolism issues, I don't think this new logo is as suitable as the original. Just isn't as instantly recognizable which is important in a small text-less icon IMO.  Vote: Old logo

Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

Vote: Keep #!

It's clean, concise, and indicative of the distro's name. The proposed design doesn't do it for me.

I don't see why Crunchbang needs a new logo, anyhow. It's still new and thus consistency is important for recognition. I think changing it would be a mistake.

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Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

omns wrote:

Let's keep a lid on any tweaking ideas until after the poll. I think the tweak offered actually accentuates the problem identified so far.

What's on the table here is a simple 'for' or 'against' the proposed new logo.


Against. I like the original logo.

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Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

Just a reminder that votes need to be made at the launchpad poll to count.

https://launchpad.net/~crunchbangers/+p … ote-simple

Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

omns wrote:

Just a reminder that votes need to be made at the launchpad poll to count.

https://launchpad.net/~crunchbangers/+p … ote-simple

Hrm...so the Crunchbangers already decided on the "winner", yet only the Crunchbangers can decide?  I am confused.

I view KDE like I view snow. It looks fun and marvelous, it's fun to play in, but after a while I just want someone to take it all away.

Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

This one was a nice surprise. smile
I thougt the concept is great, and was shocked when i realized many of you see nazi symbolism in it.
I'm a pacifist from heart, and didn't want to post anything that might be offending.

Dick Laurent is dead.

Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

kBang wrote:

Hrm...so the Crunchbangers already decided on the "winner", yet only the Crunchbangers can decide?  I am confused.

No, corenominal decided the winner, not the crunchbangers team.

Yes, I noticed to that you need to be a crunchbanger on launchpad to be able to vote. That's not such a big problem. Get a launchpad account and apply to be a crunchbanger and one of the crunchbangers admins (myself, corenominal or Nik_Doof) will approve you fairly quickly smile If membership is a big problem it's fairly easy to deactivate your account down the track smile

Edit: Actually on closer inspection you may only need to have a launchpad account to be able to vote. Not sure.

Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

omns wrote:

Edit: Actually on closer inspection you may only need to have a launchpad account to be able to vote. Not sure.

Must be a member of Crunchbangers, I was already a member of launchpad.  I requested membership, TonyJ.

I view KDE like I view snow. It looks fun and marvelous, it's fun to play in, but after a while I just want someone to take it all away.

Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

kBang wrote:

Must be a member of Crunchbangers, I was already a member of launchpad.  I requested membership, TonyJ.

Approved smile

Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

holt wrote:

This one was a nice surprise. smile
I thougt the concept is great, and was shocked when i realized many of you see nazi symbolism in it.
I'm a pacifist from heart, and didn't want to post anything that might be offending.

I think that is why no one is mad at you for it looking swastika-ish because we know you didn't mean it. I like the contemporary and minimalist style of it, but unfortunatly "the best laid plans..." (IMHO)

Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

Kuno wrote:

Hadn't really taken much care of the Logo-Competition, but being curious took a look at the winning logo. Uups yikes
Like Pobolch I'm from germany and my first thought also was also "swastika".

stopie wrote:

Deep thoughts of stopie:Sucks that Nazism ruined a religious symbol almost as old as time...and that the world cant get past it - but its probably nessicary to prevent such bad things from happening again...idk, its a bit too deep for a forum tongue

Voting Point 1:However, I too first thought "swastika-ish" when I saw the logo, and becasue the world cant get past the Nazi reference, I think it would most certainly = at least some bad press. And #! is still new, so I would venture to say that it should avoid as much bad press as possible. +1 for old Logo

Voting Point 2: I always enjoyed how the old logo #! reminds me of "#! bin/bash" - made crunchbang seem more "linux" than other distributions to me...I know, I'm crazy. But when my friend mentioned that he had seen "#!" before, and I said "bin bash?" - he got a good kick out of it. +1 for old Logo

Well...theres the thought process...Vote = Nope!

I wholeheartedly agree with stopie, especially point 2. I even think that at least potential german users might find that logo reason enough to not even tryout #!.

Keep the old "logo" please.
For me it's quite unique, just like this wonderful distro.

I totally agree with both Stopie and Kuno. My first thought was "swastika-ish" and I really don't want to use my laptop in public with the rather dark theme and swastika-like symbols on the desktop. And I'm pretty sure this is not only a German issue, it's valid for at least whole of Europe.

And for the scaling issue the old logo must be the most scaleable there is! I'd rather se a more advanced logo to use when that is needed in combination with the old logo when minimalism is wanted!

Next: register on launchpad and vote no!

Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

holt wrote:

This one was a nice surprise. :)
I thougt the concept is great, and was shocked when i realized many of you see nazi symbolism in it.
I'm a pacifist from heart, and didn't want to post anything that might be offending.

Holt, you are not to blame. It is a good suggestion and the Swastika in itself is a beautiful, friendly and graphically perfect symbol.

The only ones to blame are the Nazis for one more succesful crime - identifying this old religious symbol of life with death, hate and violence. However we have to deal with the facts unfortunately.

pobolch

Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

holt wrote:

This one was a nice surprise. smile
I thougt the concept was/is great, and was shocked when i realized many of you see nazi symbolism in it.
I'm a pacifist from heart, and didn't want to post anything that might be offending.

I agree your concept is great, congratulations Holt and thank you for submitting the winning logo! I will have to see about organising some sort of prize, regardless of the outcome of the vote.

Regarding the whole swastika thing, personally I really do not see the link, other than both symbols being visually strong. I would not like to dismiss the subject, but I do think it is a real shame that once a subject like this has been touched on, it will tend to run and run. sad

Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

corenominal wrote:

Regarding the whole swastika thing, personally I really do not see the link, other than both symbols being visually strong. I would not like to dismiss the subject, but I do think it is a real shame that once a subject like this has been touched on, it will tend to run and run. :(

I was aware of this but as you can see I am not the only one seeing the Swastika similarity. Do you think I shouldn't have been warning? If so I am sorry for the showstopper. However at least in Germany this is likely to be a real problem. If this logo will be the official one I will definitely have to switch the distro. Please understand this. Innocence got lost due to THEIR crimes, not by me mentioning this.

Nevertheless thanks for your great work and keep that simple #!

Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

pobolch wrote:
corenominal wrote:

Regarding the whole swastika thing, personally I really do not see the link, other than both symbols being visually strong. I would not like to dismiss the subject, but I do think it is a real shame that once a subject like this has been touched on, it will tend to run and run. sad

I was aware of this but as you can see I am not the only one seeing the Swastika similarity. Do you think I shouldn't have been warning? If so I am sorry for the showstopper.

Not at all, the purpose of this thread is to have an open discussion. smile

Re: Logo competition: a discussion about the winning logo

hmmmm...
Maybe I'm a bit too stubborn and/or simplistic, but
a) I don't really see the 'swastika-connection' either
and b) even if it looks a little like a swastika, so what?

I really think people should lighten up and think a little more, instead of jumping to conclusions and trying to link together things that are totally unrelated.
For me, people who do that show that they don't know what they are talking about.

A few examples:
- Hans Reiser killed his wife. Unfortunately, these things happen. But why should we stop using ReiserFS?
- Hitler created a great infrastructure in Germany (mostly for troops-movement). Should the Germans therefore stop driving on their Autobahns?
- The Catholic church killed/discriminated probably millions of people in its existance. Should people therefore stop being Christians? (I'd say yes in this case, but that's another matter tongue)

In short, things aren't always what they look like at first glance. Heck, things aren't always what everyone says they are.

If someone should see my desktop with a logo that has a faint resemblance to a swastika, there are a couple of things they can do:
1) Think to themselves 'That's a swastika, he must be a nazi'
   Fine with me, let them think what they want. I know I'm not a nazi.
2) Ask me if it's a swastika, and if it's there because I'm a nazi.
   I can tell them no, it's not a swastika, it's the logo of a very nice Ubuntu distribution. Maybe I can 'convert' them into being a crunchbanger also.
3) Ignore it.
  Fine with me smile

I voted 'no' for the new logo, because I like the old one better smile

just my heavily devaluated 2 cents smile

Name the greatest of all inventors. Accident. - Mark Twain