• From: California, USA
  • Registered: 2008-11-29
  • Posts: 8,647

Re: #! zero

slapfish wrote:

FWIW, I think removing is quicker than installing...or isn't it?

If you don't include the time for downloading, removing is the same or faster than installing but my point was that its easier to compile a list of packages you want as opposed to the stuff you don't want. Also the former list could be much shorter depending on what distro you're trying to customize.

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  • From: Melbourne
  • Registered: 2009-03-26
  • Posts: 86

Re: #! zero

It's a good idea. It's been done before with Crunchbang Lite vs Crunchbang full. Maybe a similar idea was planned anyway for final release.

Getting a distro and installing your favourite apps is part of the fun, but having to remove the apps you're replacing can be a pain in the arse.

#! Statler on eeepc 1000H
#! Statler alpha 2 on eeepc 701

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28 Reply by luc

  • luc
  • #! Die-hard
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  • From: Munich, Germany
  • Registered: 2010-03-21
  • Posts: 560

Re: #! zero

a rather comprehensive list of commands (not only apps) is provided by "dmenu_path" (preinstalled on statler ob!, xfce?). this is used by the alternative menu (default) key: ALT+F3.

interesting discussion guys.

  • From: the Netherlands
  • Registered: 2010-03-07
  • Posts: 812

Re: #! zero

What i did was to edit omns post-install-script
http://crunchbanglinux.org/forums/topic … ll-script/

Now it installs and removes everything i do and don't want. It worked flawlessly when i installed Statler Alpha2.

Instead of keeping track somewhere of my (un)installed packages, i keep this script updated.

Compaq Presario A900 - #! Statler Alpha2 Openbox
Privacy & Security on #! - Application List
  • From: Florida, Occupied C.S.A.
  • Registered: 2009-04-25
  • Posts: 291

Re: #! zero

snowpine wrote:

Personally I think there is an unfortunate tendency to call distros "bloated." It is a buzzword that rubs me the wrong way.

There is a huge misconception that removing applications you don't personally use will somehow magically make your computer 55% faster or something. News flash: the only benefit to removing transmission is a few mb of hard drive space.

I'm using Xubuntu 10.04 and it takes up less than 3 gb on my 80 gig HDD. Yet I have always read descriptions of it as "bloated," but never understood why. To me, the term "bloat" should refer to software that is used for the OS rather than directly for the user. Like anti-virus, registry cleaner, defragging programs, spyware busters, and other "bloatware" that was vital to keep Windows from crashing or slowing to a crawl (which it did anyway eventually in spite of all that vigilance). That is bloat. Having more than one office app or web browser is simply the user's preference, and it's easy enough to delete stuff you don't use.

If software slowed down my machine (lots of daemons running in the background or something), maybe that might qualify as "bloat," but the newest Xubuntu approaches transwarp speed on my old Dell with it's scant 512 RAM. It boots up faster than my cellular phone and lets me compose e-mail, chat, surf, do my schoolwork, and edit music for dance routines all at once with no delays and no hesitation. I would hardly call that bloated! I call it awesome.

You're right, Snowpine. The term is misused and overused. Thanks for saying so.

Still lean and fast even with all that GUI stuff,
Robin

DixieDancer's Website

  • Registered: 2008-11-24
  • Posts: 1,858

Re: #! zero

Tunafish wrote:

What i did was to edit omns post-install-script
http://crunchbanglinux.org/forums/topic … ll-script/

Now it installs and removes everything i do and don't want. It worked flawlessly when i installed Statler Alpha2.

Instead of keeping track somewhere of my (un)installed packages, i keep this script updated.

Good solution, Tunafish!

  • From: Heredia, Costa Rica
  • Registered: 2010-06-28
  • Posts: 19

Re: #! zero

I actually like the idea of a #! zero. What I hated about using ubuntu is that it came with a lot of software that I don't use and trying a Debian netinstall is too much work until you get something useful (at least it did for me because I just wanted to get rid of the gui programs but to keep the overall system config apps and utilites). The space usage doesn't bother me but I'm kind of a control-freak when it comes to my computer and I really don't like to install or have installed software that don't use at all. I think the perfect #! zero (at least for me) would be something like this:

http://img64.imageshack.us/img64/633/42pm.png

That way I'll keep the overall #! experience but with only my preferred apps and with no need to uninstall the others...

  • Registered: 2008-11-24
  • Posts: 1,858

Re: #! zero

Sweet illustration! I agree that would be a nice remix for the minimalists among us, so I'll second the idea. smile

#!0 is a weird and catchy name, better than #! Lite in my opinion.

  • From: Heredia, Costa Rica
  • Registered: 2010-06-28
  • Posts: 19

Re: #! zero

Yeah! I like it! #!0 looks and sounds cool! big_smile

  • From: California, USA
  • Registered: 2008-11-29
  • Posts: 8,647

Re: #! zero

#! Zero from the makers of Coke Zero. Err wait thats not right.

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  • From: Heredia, Costa Rica
  • Registered: 2010-06-28
  • Posts: 19

Re: #! zero

Has corenominal seen this thread? I really look forward for a #!0 edition!!!

37 Reply by ali

  • ali
  • #! Die-hard
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  • Registered: 2010-05-31
  • Posts: 1,034

Re: #! zero

era506 wrote:

Has corenominal seen this thread? I really look forward for a #!0 edition!!!

he probably already read this thread

openbox-logout exit on escape
  • From: Austin, TX
  • Registered: 2009-11-17
  • Posts: 223

Re: #! zero

DixieDancer wrote:
snowpine wrote:

Personally I think there is an unfortunate tendency to call distros "bloated." It is a buzzword that rubs me the wrong way.

There is a huge misconception that removing applications you don't personally use will somehow magically make your computer 55% faster or something. News flash: the only benefit to removing transmission is a few mb of hard drive space.

I'm using Xubuntu 10.04 and it takes up less than 3 gb on my 80 gig HDD. Yet I have always read descriptions of it as "bloated," but never understood why. To me, the term "bloat" should refer to software that is used for the OS rather than directly for the user. Like anti-virus, registry cleaner, defragging programs, spyware busters, and other "bloatware" that was vital to keep Windows from crashing or slowing to a crawl (which it did anyway eventually in spite of all that vigilance). That is bloat. Having more than one office app or web browser is simply the user's preference, and it's easy enough to delete stuff you don't use.

If software slowed down my machine (lots of daemons running in the background or something), maybe that might qualify as "bloat," but the newest Xubuntu approaches transwarp speed on my old Dell with it's scant 512 RAM. It boots up faster than my cellular phone and lets me compose e-mail, chat, surf, do my schoolwork, and edit music for dance routines all at once with no delays and no hesitation. I would hardly call that bloated! I call it awesome.

You're right, Snowpine. The term is misused and overused. Thanks for saying so.

Still lean and fast even with all that GUI stuff,
Robin

Very nice cool

I used to be a Xubuntu whore, but then I discovered openbox.... still run Xubuntu on my iMac though. Works like a charm!

  • From: Montevideo, Uruguay
  • Registered: 2010-07-12
  • Posts: 10

Re: #! zero

I believe that there should be two versions of #!: zero and full.
Let me explain y point of view:
there are some of us who don't care having extra programs laying around, never being used. We are OK with transmission being installed by default, since we don't really care about some megabytes of hard disk space, and maybe, while we don't use it regularly, it may help us when we are in a hurry.
Then there are those who want their system to be a lean, mean fighting machine, with only what's necessary, or they have very strong feelings towards their software of choice.
And for those in the middle (I include myself) it's not that hard to move from either end to the middle, I don't like transmission? i remove it, bue i still have gFTP to save my ass some day.
Anyway, it's just my way of seeing it

marcocen's Website

  • Registered: 2009-03-12
  • Posts: 162

Re: #! zero

+1 for #!Zero (and zero sounds better than lite)


I always used the Lite version in the past. in the full, even if you remove all the progs you don't want through apt you still have to go and manually clean up the menu.

  • Registered: 2010-07-16
  • Posts: 24

Re: #! zero

I like this idea of keeping minimal distro, I'm not so good building  environment from minimal and some of my really old computer still enjoy the taste of #!
With #! Lite, I was about 80mb ram witch is really low.
It must be a lot of work to do that: one Statler with OpenBox (32 & 64) and an other with XFCE, if there is one #! Zero version, I'll take it!
In fact, I put #! 9.04 on my old laptop ( more than 10 years) work like a charm and I put the same in my pc (phenom X4 965, 8GiB, Raptor, blabla...) and again it was really fast.
Statler give us a different kind with a nice and hard work on the build itself, so I will wait and see but please think at those poor old pc that will died (maybe)!!
We have to fight to keep our machine alive for the next generation!! They will be amazed with what we still doing!!

42 Reply by wuy

  • wuy
  • #! Member
  • Offline
  • Registered: 2009-02-05
  • Posts: 74

Re: #! zero

For the OP (alexander): 5 GB is a lot really but OpenOffice takes a lot of space.
The quickest way for you to save some space is to install localepurge. Check carefully which locale(s) it will preserve and run it as root.
Debian Netinstall is very effective. I have an 'old' desktop so I don't have non-free needs out-of-the-box. Netinstall installs a nothing lacking/almost nothing extra (it keeps tasksel, which obviously could be automatically removed during the installation) base system.
Then, say, to have a basic LXDE system, with SLiM login manager one only needs a

apt-get install alsa-base alsa-utils xorg slim lxde

This brings Iceweasel as well (see recommends at http://packages.debian.org/squeeze/lxde).
Or you can run the command above without lxde and then

apt-get install --no-install-recommends lxde

If you're OK with Iceweasel but, say, want rhythmbox in place of lxmusic, then

apt-get install alsa-base alsa-utils xorg slim rhythmbox lxde lxmusic-

The dash (-) prevents a recommended dependency to be installed.
You can also enable Googles' repo before all this and install it in which case lxde won't pull Iceweasel.
See an example at http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?p=313732#p313732

This is just to say Netinstall is great but you won't have the #! customizations and also I think there must be some extra steps if you need to install some non-free firmware.

Last edited by wuy (2010-08-07 21:53:36)

  • kBang
  • #! Die-hard
  • Offline
  • From: Calera, AL, USA
  • Registered: 2009-01-06
  • Posts: 774

Re: #! zero

DixieDancer wrote:

I'm using Xubuntu 10.04 and it takes up less than 3 gb on my 80 gig HDD. Yet I have always read descriptions of it as "bloated," but never understood why.

It stems from previous versions of Xubuntu which included things that were unnecessary, like gnome-panel and such.  Thus the download was bloated, if not the actual performance.  Many preferred a clean XFCE install along with a core ubuntu net install, purists.

I view KDE like I view snow. It looks fun and marvelous, it's fun to play in, but after a while I just want someone to take it all away.
  • Registered: 2009-03-12
  • Posts: 162

Re: #! zero

Even if there is no official #!0 release, we can make one with remastersys, right?

  • Registered: 2010-03-26
  • Posts: 548

Re: #! zero

Even if there is no official #!0 release, we can make one with remastersys, right?

Not with CrunchBang being Debian based, not with Remastersys, at least not until its author finishes the changes necessary to make them [more] compatible.  To my knowledge on these forums Val_B is the only person to [seem to] get them to play together.

SEE http://crunchbanglinux.org/forums/post/79688/#p79688 for results

Some people hereabouts suggest using Debian Live which CrunchBang is based on to make cloned disks but I've not tried that.

EDIT - added quote

EDIT - have you seen this http://crunchbanglinux.org/forums/post/76486/#p76486

Last edited by winotree (2010-08-16 22:15:57)

  • Registered: 2009-12-11
  • Posts: 181

Re: #! zero

alexander wrote:
era506 wrote:

Has corenominal seen this thread? I really look forward for a #!0 edition!!!

he probably already read this thread

I bloody-well 'ope not...he should be busy removing applications!!!   tongue

Iceweasel, gimp, thunar and gedit are the only applications I keep from the original install so I'm in favour of a stripped-down version.  ( #!- )

$ dpkg --get-selections > Packages

...gives you a nice copy of everything that's installed. (The file is saved to your home folder)

In the past, I've also used xfce-appfinder (in the repos) which lists just the applications.

  • Unia
  • #! Die-hard
  • Offline
  • From: The Netherlands
  • Registered: 2010-07-17
  • Posts: 2,127

Re: #! zero

That would definetely be a good thing! Right now I'm doing minimal installs and configuring everything on top of that, but I'm running out of base distro's now seeing most of them give me issues. Minimal #! would be so awesome

Let's do it and don't screw it.
  • From: Somerville, Taxachusetts
  • Registered: 2009-09-14
  • Posts: 50

Re: #! zero

I for one am all for not looking a gift-horse in the mouth, but if Corenominal wants to make #!bones (or #!0, I'm cool with either), I would download that version and run an adapted version of Omns script.

I think that would be doubly nice for saving  bandwidth for Corenominal! I was pretty excited about Statler's  optional install of Open Office and Dropbox through pipemenus!

(I had dropbox leftover in my home folder and my old autostart.sh, so when I started Statler for the first time (outside of virtual box), the dropbox pipe had already adjusted itself!)

Just Rick... Thanks.

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